Breakers 1st Game: Vs Hawks - Thu Sep 18

[Soft Copy]

It's an eagerly awaited season for Breakers fans with a couple of new signings and obviously a couple of personnel missing from last season. Following last season's break-through trip to the play-offs, fans are already looking for an even better return this season. Some of the questions we look to be answered are:

1. How well will we rebound when Rickert is off the court?
2. How much will we miss Vukona's injection of energy off the bench?
3. How adequately will Boucher's contribution offset the loss of Vukona?
4. Will Rickert be back to the best we saw of him last season?
5. How much more time and space will our shooters have with the arrival of Bruton?

On paper, this should be the ideal start for the Breakers. The Hawks will be willing and well-drilled and will definitely be a test but the Breakers should go a little deeper on the bench and ease away in the second half for a comfortable victory IMO. Saville's broken finger must be a factor, though he's adamant he'll just pay through it.

The Breakers back-court must be considered one of the best in league (albiet without yet having played a competitive game) and it also remains to be seen how long the Bruton-Penney partnership takes to "bed in" and really fire.

The collective sporting mood of this country is pretty high after a Tr-Nations rugby victory on Saturday and the Warriors' upset win over the Storm in their play-off game on Sunday and I would expect the NSEC should see a good crowd for this one.

[Teve0]

Stream the game on justin.tv plz soft copy!!

[Soft Copy]

Stream the game on justin.tv plz soft copy!!

I'm not sure what that means?!? How would I do that? I'm no luddite but it may be beyond me (that is, if you're serious - I'm not even sure about that...). Are you in Aus Teve0? Aren't Fox showing the Breakers games this season?

[Barnaby]

There are a couple of other questions that may need answering as well..

1) Has Oscar Forman improved his ability to guard anything quicker than a light pole?
2) Does the team have the leg speed to stay with the quicker guards in the league ie. Tait, Franklin and to a lesser extent Rhys Martin?
3) Is the Bear going to start showing his age this season?

Dont get me wrong this will be a challenge on the road for the Hawks, and the Breakers have done well reloading in the offseason - but should be alot closer than people think.

[Soft Copy]

There are a couple of other questions that may need answering as well..

1) Has Oscar Forman improved his ability to guard anything quicker than a light pole?
2) Does the team have the leg speed to stay with the quicker guards in the league ie. Tait, Franklin and to a lesser extent Rhys Martin?
3) Is the Bear going to start showing his age this season?

You're right about those questions. Another regarding Forman is: will he shoot the ball with anything like the accuracy he showed in seasons prior to the last one? He doesn't do a lot else so needs to contribute in that way at least. The other thing he could do is have a go at rebounding and see how he likes it, with a view to maybe even dong it on a regular basis!

[Mammon]

oi, ozcar 4man is AS SOFT AS SILK man, he should never play the 4 spot, NEVER. he's a bloody Tofu Forward. :voices:


The Depth Chart for New Zealand Breakers 2008/09


Starting-five

PG: CJ Bruton
SG: Kirk Penney
TF: Oscar Forman
PF: Tony Ronaldson
C: Rick Rickert*

Bench

PG: Paul Henare
SG: Phill Jones
SF: Dillon Boucher
PF: Adam Tanner
C: Tim Behrendorff

DP1: Corey Webster (PG)
DP2: Thomas Abercrombie (SG/SF)

[Moth]

3) Is the Bear going to start showing his age this season?



He already did last season.

[nzbreakers]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think the Breakers are the only team in the competition this year with only a sole import.

I do feel that we need more backup in our big man department if we are to be genuine contenders...

Anything worse than top four finish this season will count as a disappointment for the club, the front office, and for the fans.

Look at other clubs...they are mostly stacked up with a pair of imports along with former restricted players i.e. naturalised Aussies/Kiwis

I will keep an eye on Tanner and esp Behrendorff all season long... the other eye on the team as a whole of cos.

For Behrendorff , it is time for the 26 yr old (turning 27 in a few days) centre to show some major improvement (not ot mention the ageing factor of our good old bear Ronaldson)

As we all know, this is a fairly old squad... time is ticking... I am not trying to be hasty or anything but

I definitely expect big things from them in fairly a short time i.e. this year or next year.

I honestly don't think Jones, Ronaldson, and even CJ will be hanging around beyond that time or can compete at the same level as they are capable now

if they do not get on with a good start, it won't be long before I jump on a bandwagon and complaining to the management for having decided to go with a sole import. (Remember I had an idea of dropping Paul Henare and get a cheap backup point guard like Luke Martin. By doing this and releasing Behrendorff will make enough pointcap room for recruiting the second import. )

[fan since the old snakepit]

Any chance of someone in NZ recording the game and sending me a DVD of it. Please PM me if you could and I will supply details.Would be much appreciated.

[kc4mvp]

Live stream on the PC would be good

[Soft Copy]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think the Breakers are the only team in the competition this year with only a sole import.

I do feel that we need more backup in our big man department if we are to be genuine contenders...
I absolutely agree. I've said before that rebounding will be an issue this season. Neither Forman, nor Ronaldson are any great shakes in this department and I worry about who's going to grab them when Rickert is off the court.

I will keep an eye on Tanner and esp Behrendorff all season long...

For Behrendorff , it is time for the 26 yr old (turning 27 in a few days) centre to show some major improvement (not ot mention the ageing factor of our good old bear Ronaldson)
Again, right on the money. He had a good first season with the Breakers, but that was under the guidance of John Dorge, who is obviously no longer with the club. His contributions since have not been to the same standard and I wonder if the quality of the one-to-one big man coaching has suffered too much for the club's good since his departure.

Tonight will be a good test of exactly what we're worrying about; Dusty has a habbit of sneaking in for those opportunist o-boards and our defensive organisation and tenacity will have to be spot on to minimise the number of 2nd chance points we concede.

[Soft Copy]

Live stream on the PC would be good

Radio commentary here (http://www.radiosport.co.nz) at least. Just hit "Listen Live"

[Mammon]

Dusty Rychart and Cam Tragardh got the nod in the pre-season games, but Larry Davidson is the club's tallest player and could be promoted at Tragardh's expense if the team line-ups for this week's training scrimmages by the Hawks were any guide.

Off-season recruit Anthony Petrie was also impressive in trials and could easily come into calculations.

Cooks had all but made up his mind on the team on Monday but was reluctant to give anything away.


correct me if I'm wrong, isn't 209cm tragardh 3cm taller than davidson? maybe davidson is wearing a pair of HUGE red high-heeled shoes this season? :mrgreen:


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/45/Red_High_Heel_Pumps.jpg


Listen to Radio Sport's live coverage of the Hawks-Breakers game on Thursday night from 7:30PM NZST (5:30PM AEST).


crap.

[Hogsbreath]

I hope this game goes into tripple OT :D

[anonymouse]

I'm 100% certain Davidson is taller than Trigger.

Fuck i wish this game was on tv. Ringing up Austar tonight to lodge a complaint, hopefully get a discount.

[Soft Copy]

Mammon, I'm really struggling with your posts - a thread is potentially ruined when you join in, due to the incredibly low calibre of your contributions - they tend to be either bigoted, ignorant, irrelevant, obscure or any number of combinations of the above.

Sorry to be so blunt but I'd really appreciated you not contributing to any thread I've started (or at least not in the way you are currently doing) - a giant picture of a red stiletto pretty much sums up the value you usually provide; i.e. none at all.

[fan since the old snakepit]

I'm 100% certain Davidson is taller than Trigger.

(Extremely Naughty Word!) i wish this game was on tv. Ringing up Austar tonight to lodge a complaint, hopefully get a discount.

Also complain about NBA playoffs and WNBA lack of games. I got 10% for 5 months but I rekon I should have tried for more. Tell all you friends to do the same even if they dont like b/ball :fox: / austar will think they do.

[Mammon]

I'm 100% certain Davidson is taller than Trigger.


so, how tall is he (with shoes)? 212cm?

[Soft Copy]

For fuck's sake - a quick trip to their website reveals Davidson is 206 cm tall and Tragardh is 209.

Now can we stop this pointless debate and have some well-reasoned insight into what might transpire in tonight's game? Too much to ask?

And if you post another picture of a shoe Mammon, I'll hunt you down and make you eat one!

[fan since the old snakepit]

Well if the website says that it is wrong. Davidson is 3 or 4 cms taller than Trigger so I would say Davo is close to 212cm.

[fan since the old snakepit]

Live scores have Breakers up 4-2 before the game has even started. Have two of the Hawks and one of the Breakers got the wrong coloured shorts on :?

[Soft Copy]

And apparently we're in the 2nd period already. When are these fuckwits going to get their shit together?

[fan since the old snakepit]

Thank fuck for the radio. Live score back to their usually shit.

[Soft Copy]

Rickert 5 rebounds already - I think three were from his own missed shots...

[fan since the old snakepit]

Tragardh must be injured. Did not start and Petrie on first sub.

[fan since the old snakepit]

Hawks up 26-21 at 1/4 time.

[fan since the old snakepit]

Commentators think Luke Martin is playing for the Hawks.

Just fixed it. Someone must have tapped them on the shoulder.

And of course NBL live scores have just shit themselves

[bad gambler]

Cheers for the updates

[kc4mvp]

Why is Trigger not on

Why is Rhys on

[fan since the old snakepit]

I can only assume Trigger is injured.

Martin appears to be doing well . Couple of assists couple or steals and zero turnovers.

[fan since the old snakepit]

NZ commentators just said that Mat Campbell just got off the MOST HORRIBLEST shot you will ever see.
All class.

51-45 Hawks up 1.33 to go in the second

[Snake77]

When I followed the link and hit listen live it took me to the rugby. What's doing???

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[fan since the old snakepit]

Try the Breakers Hawks listen here from 7.30 box just below


Hawks 51-50 up at the half. No Tragardh

[fan since the old snakepit]

Commentators just called Tony Ronaldson a 7 footer. Were they talking about the girth of his arse.

[Snake77]

Thanks. I gave that a try but no go. Comes up with 'The page cannot be displayed'

This is the link - http://www1.streaming.net.nz/meta/trn-spare.asx

[kc4mvp]

needed trigger

[Mammon]

HT: breakers 50:51 hawks

fuck, tanner is a fucking DP standard player, tehrendorff is still in ABA level, ageing bear not good enough, 4man is still a tofu forward as usual. ronaldson for coach after this game?

Tip: hawks by 3-6.

[fan since the old snakepit]

Breakers up 74 -73 1 min to go in 3rd. Penney going crazy 16 for the 1/4

[fan since the old snakepit]

79-75 Breakers Penney 19 in the 3rd.

Hawks without Trigger doing OK

[The Howster]

The broadcast doesn't appear to be on their regular audio channel, so use this link:

http://www1.streaming.net.nz/meta/trn-spare.asx

[Teve0]

Who the hells this tommy bartlett they keep mentioning??

Pennys unconcious

[fan since the old snakepit]

Thanks for the help . Would be far too difficult to have posted the link on the NBL site for the other three remaining NBL fans who dont know obout Ozhoops.

[fan since the old snakepit]

Hawks fallen in a hole. 18 down with 5 to go. Breakers behind Penney blowing it right out.

[The Howster]

Actually, the link is on the front page of the site.

[fan since the old snakepit]

Sorry. Just assumed it wasn't there after I tried to find one for last Sat night game.

[bad gambler]

Great game from Penney tonight especially that 3rd quarter

[WilloWildWaves]

Great win for the Breakers, I really like their roster this season can't wait to see them in action when they come to perth :D

[NZB]

The loss of Vukona and replacing him with Tanner is hurting already.

We're going to struggle if Rickert goes down or gets into foul trouble.

That said, good luck to teams trying to stop Penney and CJ, swarm 1, and swarm 2 with Jones and Forman.

[Mammon]

Kirk "Ball God" Penney is way too good 4 this league. the tall blacks should make the olympics if he plays like that against germany.

[angry ant]

Here's a sweet report of the game- http://www.nbl.com.au/default.aspx?s=newsdisplay&id=76020

The home side leapt out of the blocks quicker with Rickert announcing his home court return via a sweet baseline spin and dunk followed up by a Forman three on the next possession for a 10-4 lead.

Early in the second Bruton began to find his range, draining a sweet three from the corner after Tony Ronaldson had tip-toed down the baseline.

On the last play of the half Penney brought up only his tenth point of the half with a sweet cross-over dribble, drive and lay-up to cut the Hawks’ lead to one (50-51).

Penney then replied to a Mat Campbell bomb with a brace of his own to put New Zealand out to a 74-68 lead but a sweet fake jumper and coolly taken three from danger-man Saville saw the Hawks only three arrears.

In the fourth Forman followed up Penney’s sixth three with his first and then promptly added a sweet second midway through the final stanza.

That's one sweet report!!

[bigdog]

Some thoughts (not all positive despite the win)

- How much rot can some incredible Kirk Penney shooting hide?

- How long is the Oscar starting caper going to continue??

- Adam Tanner? What is he doing in the squad?!!!?

- Why would you play Burton and Henare at the same time?

- Why did Mika Vukona leave the Breakers - to play 12 minutes for the Dragons (1st game)? We love you, please come back, although you were dumb to leave...

- What are the Breakers going to do about the four spot? Ronaldson is good for some (diminishing). After that it is all smoke and mirrors

- Are there 2 more talented Development players in the league than The Breakers? And why did they leave promising College Careers in the States?

[Soft Copy]

Tip: hawks by 3-6.

Brilliant tip. Stop fouling up these boards with your presence please.

[anonymouse]

Guess Sav's finger wasnt bothering him that much.

Anyone know where Trigger is? Will I get to see a full squad on Saturday?

Penney shot our lights out. Good victory for NZ but from the sounds of things they have some areas to work on. Those shots miss and the Hawks might have taken it.

[nzbreakers]

Great win for Captain Kirk and the boys

HOWEVER!!!

As I mentioned before, we have some serious problems down low...

- Forman got into a foul trouble early on... so Boucher played at 4 for a while in the 1st half. I don't think the Breakers can do this all season long. -> We are not talking about Auckland Stars here...

- and then... Tim Behrendorff came on and played like shit... Again... we are not talking Harbour Heat here..
He is going to get raped when he comes against the likes of Ben Pepper, Ben Knight, etc. - this just shows the quality of other teams' backup bigs

- I was not that impressed with CJ either... he doesn't seem to be the player he used to be. Hope he comes back strong next game (vs Tigers...oh maybe the game after that)

AGAIN.... I believe we are wayyy toooo vulnerable on the inside matchups
So here's my suggestion... they must make a quick and smart decision asap like below.
Release Behrendorff and relegate Tanner to the Development squad (i.e. 11th man)
Get a big man who can actually play at this level on a consistent basis. not someone who struggles even during garbage mins (How contrasting it was when Abercrombie and Webster came on and played like veterans whereas Behrendorff got raped hard on the other side of the court)

If they do not do this.. Breakers only can do as well as what they are on paper... (top 4 finish at best)

Btw, many of the Breakers fans in this forum seem to agree with me on this... I can only hope that the club management are as bright as their fans

[Shuttlesworth]

41 for Kirk! Well done. Would have loved to have seen that but it seems maori tv has turned it's nose up at us too! I bet it was an entertaining 41 points too...when he gets rolling he is fun to watch. He is a pretty damn good player come to think of it...

[Mighty Dunks]

First game back in Hawks colours and Saville scores more than he ever did as a King.

[Moth]

Whoo, what a performance by Penney! 41 on 16/22 FG, 6/10 3PT and 3/3 FT. Boy can play.

[Voice(s)]

Kirk Penney, what a chump. :wink:

[kc4mvp]

did the Hawks play a zone in the 2nd half?

[paxson]

Great win for Captain Kirk and the boys

HOWEVER!!!

As I mentioned before, we have some serious problems down low...

- Forman got into a foul trouble early on... so Boucher played at 4 for a while in the 1st half. I don't think the Breakers can do this all season long. -> We are not talking about Auckland Stars here...

- and then... Tim Behrendorff came on and played like shit... Again... we are not talking Harbour Heat here..
He is going to get raped when he comes against the likes of Ben Pepper, Ben Knight, etc. - this just shows the quality of other teams' backup bigs

- I was not that impressed with CJ either... he doesn't seem to be the player he used to be. Hope he comes back strong next game (vs Tigers...oh maybe the game after that)

AGAIN.... I believe we are wayyy toooo vulnerable on the inside matchups
So here's my suggestion... they must make a quick and smart decision asap like below.
Release Behrendorff and relegate Tanner to the Development squad (i.e. 11th man)
Get a big man who can actually play at this level on a consistent basis. not someone who struggles even during garbage mins (How contrasting it was when Abercrombie and Webster came on and played like veterans whereas Behrendorff got raped hard on the other side of the court)

If they do not do this.. Breakers only can do as well as what they are on paper... (top 4 finish at best)

Btw, many of the Breakers fans in this forum seem to agree with me on this... I can only hope that the club management are as bright as their fans

Its going to be very difficult for Ben Pepper to Rape Timmy as he doesnt have a contact with anyone this season.

[Teve0]

Holy shit i forgot about pepper!

hes exactly what the breakers need!

Ship the dorf and tanner out!

Man the great kirk penny was gaze like last night! looks like hes proved stumps wrong yet again.. :roll:

[isaac]

Breakers can't have done too badly to shoot 3/24 FG early on, but be down by just one point at the half?

[Stumps]

Man the great kirk penny was gaze like last night! looks like hes proved stumps wrong yet again.. :roll:
You retards may want to point out exactly what I've said that he's proved wrong.

[Poida]

Who knows Stumps. Teve0 has a distinct ability to forge personal vendettas against certain people, based on mythical statements that they said in the past.

(mod edit - deleted - personal)

[Teve0]

Who knows Stumps. Teve0 has a distinct ability to forge personal vendettas against certain people, based on mythical statements that they said in the past.

(mod edit - deleted - personal)

Woah! Firstly why would you "jump in" for stumps of all people???

and secondly stumps didnt give Penny superstar status before he had ever played a game in the league, hence Penny ended up proving him wrong!

Anyway whos following who around now!?

what are you doing in a breakers thread!?!

(mod edit - deleted - personal)

[Poida]

My point has been proven. Thanks.

[Stumps]

and secondly stumps didnt give Penny superstar status before he had ever played a game in the league, hence Penny ended up proving him wrong!
How did Penney prove me wrong?

[NZB]

If we can, I'd release Tanner and Behrendorff and re-sign Pepper. Gives us a bit more size.

[Soft Copy]

I don't want to piss on the Breakers' chips too much but I'm with those of you who think that the outstanding late shooting burst by Penney and, to a lesser extent Forman, has papered over some pretty huge cracks in the Breakers armoury.

I've said before that, with his roster, we will struggle defensively inside and will also be found wanting in the rebounding department when our starters are not on the floor.

Behrendorff's regression as a player is particularly worrying - he's too young to be a player who delivers less for his team with each passing season. It really looks like some remedial individual sessions are needed here (bring back assistant coach Dorge for a short, intensive spell?). With Tanner, it's difficult to assess his worth on the basis of limited minutes in one game (though I guess the amount of court time tells us something). However, I did hear Ronaldson and Penney discussing him on the weekly basketball hour on Radio Sport and all the talk was of his personality and not his ability so I guess that may be a pointer as well...

The idea of releasing Behrendorff and Tanner and bringing in Pepper (and presumably promoting Abercrombie to the ten which I would personally be very happy with) is an intriguing one. Obviously those players have contracts so it would be costly and I'm not sure of the ramifications re the salary cap (yes, there is one apparently). Of course Pepper would have to be available, to agree to come back to a club and coach that previously released him and probably not always start.

There's no doubt we missed Vukona coming off the bench and, while Boucher was his usual disruptive self on D with four steals (which was twice the number of rebounds he got in 21 minutes), he's never going to command the defensive commitment from the opposition that Mika did, thus allowing teams to put more pressure on our recognised scorers while he's on the court.

In short, unless some areas improve drastically, we're going to have to shoot like that to win games and against opposition of higher quality, that's certainly less likely to happen.

[Soft Copy]

and secondly stumps didnt give Penny superstar status before he had ever played a game in the league, hence Penny ended up proving him wrong!
How did Penney prove me wrong?

I'm going to defend Stumps here (!?!), not that he needs me to speak on his behalf I'm sure. As far as I recall, he never said Penney wouldn't be a superstar in this league; he simply stated that this prediction had been made in the past, regarding other players before they had played a match in anger and had proved to be false. He was therefore reserving judgement until there was some evidence either way. Completely reasonable.

I'm sure he now would agree that Kirk is up there offensively with the best in his postition in this league.

[Stumps]

and secondly stumps didnt give Penny superstar status before he had ever played a game in the league, hence Penny ended up proving him wrong!
How did Penney prove me wrong?

I'm going to defend Stumps here (!?!), not that he needs me to speak on his behalf I'm sure. As far as I recall, he never said Penney wouldn't be a superstar in this league; he simply stated that this prediction had been made in the past, regarding other players before they had played a match in anger and had proved to be false. He was therefore reserving judgement until there was some evidence either way. Completely reasonable.

I'm sure he now would agree that Kirk is up there offensively with the best in his postition in this league.
Exactly. Not once did I say I didn't think he would be a superstar. I just said I was going to wait to see him perform in the context of the league before considering him one myself. Clearly he's now proven himself to be an all-star scorer in the NBL context.

[bigdog]

Of course the thing that everyone has failed to mention to date about Kirk Penney game was the brilliant defence he also played. While he doesnt gamble, he gave Tait, Saviille and Franklin conniptions at times.

[isaac]

Soft Copy, sure, they had to shoot themselves out of it, but didn't they also shoot themselves into that deficit to begin with? One write-up mentioned a 3/24 FG start?

Big test coming up next.

[Soft Copy]

Soft Copy, sure, they had to shoot themselves out of it, but didn't they also shoot themselves into that deficit to begin with? One write-up mentioned a 3/24 FG start?

Yeah, I suppose you could say that. I too saw that stat and wondered at the time if it was a typo! The thing for me was that the all-round game just didn't seem to be quite there and there was too much reliance on the outside (often WAY outside) shot as their main scoring option, which is not going to drop at the same rate as it did in those final stages too often.

True, it's very early days and, as I said, I don't want to be overly negative; I just thought that there is a danger of allowing that shooting performance to conceal some pretty serious deficiancies I saw in that game. I'm sure Lemanis and the team are clever enough to identify and work on those - it's how succesful that work is which remains to be seen.